Glenn Greenwald
Politics • Writing • Culture
Using bin Laden's 9/11 Defense: Erasing the “Civilian” Category. PLUS: Reckless Abuse of the “pro-Hamas” Label to Justify Censorship & Stigmatize Criticism of Israel
Video Transcript
October 17, 2023
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Good evening. It's Monday, October 16. 

Tonight: in the aftermath of 9/11, the leader of al-Qaida, Osama bin Laden, adamantly denied having planned the attack or played any role in it. He did, however, offer theories as to why it was morally and legally justified to target American civilians with violence. Because American citizens choose their leaders, he argued, and then choose them again, when deciding to reelect them, Americans are directly responsible for those leaders' actions, including when they bomb civilians, impose sanctions regimes that starve and otherwise kill hundreds of thousands of innocent people, including children; when they destabilize other countries or work to engineer coups in other countries and when they invade and attack other countries as they did with Iraq. 

Indeed, after George W. Bush and Dick Cheney invaded Iraq and then bombed multiple other countries and tortured detainees, and implemented a program of kidnaping called “renditions,” Americans reelected them in 2004 – knowing that – and ratified all of that violence, including violence that ended up killing innocent people. Under bin Laden's theory, American civilians are not really civilians. By ratifying the violence carried out by their government, they became actively complicit in it and thus became legitimate military targets for those seeking to bring reprisals for violence by the United States against innocent people. 

Bin Laden's theory at the time provoked worldwide indignation and revulsion. After all, the category of civilian that he sought to erase was central to the entire post-World War II framework that was implemented by numerous international bodies to prevent the Holocaust or to prevent other civilian targeting atrocities that came to define that war. One reason that the 9/11 attack provoked so much anger and unity around the world was due to the consensus that civilians are civilians in all cases and can never be justifiably targeted by violence. That's called terrorism. Civilian lives are sacrosanct and they can never be deliberately targeted. This has been the consensus, the legal framework in Western morality since at least the end of World War II. 

While bin Laden's theory was widely and vehemently denounced, it has become popularized over the years and all with the same goal that he had: to find a way to justify killing civilians in large numbers, either by deliberately targeting them or dropping bombs and using violence in reckless disregard for their lives. In all wars, especially with the way they're now fought, civilian deaths are inevitable in large numbers, and we all learn the name in order to dismiss that: “collateral damage.” But what bin Laden did – as well as many others who have since followed in his footsteps – is something entirely different: it's a way of justifying either the failure to safeguard those innocent lives or to justify their targeting. If a theory can be offered as to why civilians are actually part of the military or a legitimate military target that one can legitimately destroy, then the responsibility to avoid killing civilians disappears. 

When Hamas launched its horrific attack on Israeli civilians last Saturday, they did so based on the premise that there's no such thing as an innocent Israeli civilian because they elect their governments, which then occupy or blockade Palestinian land, or because they support the killing of innocent people in Gaza, or because they serve in the Israeli Defense Forces. The category of civilian is blurred or even erased when it comes to Israel under the worldview of Hamas. That's what drove what they did in Israel on Saturday. But it's not only Hamas that has embraced this view to justify their targeting of civilians and other atrocities. Over the last week, there have been explicit statements from Israeli officials and their American supporters that promulgate a quite similar theory, namely that because the people in Gaza elected Hamas – they did so the last time an election was permitted – 16 years ago – back in 2007 when most of the population either hadn't been born yet or were far too young to vote – then it means, however, that those so-called “Palestinian civilians” are not quite civilians since they either implicitly or even expertly endorse the violence of their Hamas leaders. The growing invocation of this theory to erode and erase the concept of civilian is quite dangerous and alarming, and we think it merits a good deal of thought and analysis. 

Then: we have heard many accusations over the last week of people who are said to be “pro-Hamas,” namely, people who are said to have justified the massacres carried out against Israeli civilians or who, even worse, in general, are people who are calling for and cheering and advocating the murder of Jews. This rather pernicious label, “pro-Hamas” is often used to vilify anyone questioning, let alone opposing the actions of the Israeli and American governments – close your ears to all of that, we're told because those people are “pro-Hamas” – it's not just used to smear people's character, but it also justifies all sorts of cancel culture campaigns and even the kinds of censorship we have been reporting are now pervading the West in the wake of this new war. Echoing the left-liberal theory to justify censorship, we are told by those supporting such measures of repression: “Now about this war, we're not talking here about free speech. This is different. This is hate speech. This is incitement to violence. These people are calling for the murder of Jews.”

 Are there some people who have justified the attack by Hamas and generally endorse the killing of all Israelis? Yes, of course, there are. You can find people advocating literally any idea if you look hard enough, but as we documented last week at length, the reason it was necessary to highlight people whose names nobody knew until last week – a stray speaker at a DSA rally or some local chapter of a Black Lives Matter group or a non-tenured assistant professor no one had ever heard of – is precisely because this “pro-Hamas” view was actually quite marginalized, really reserved only to the outermost fringes Very few people – almost none with any position of power or influence – did anything other than act with disgust at what Hamas did.

The reason this phrase “pro-Hamas” is being used so indiscriminately – applied to everyone who expresses any criticism about or opposition to the acts of the Israeli and U.S. governments in response, or who insists that the lives of Palestinian civilians have the same value and worth as anybody else's – is the same reason that the people who questioned the Bush-Cheney War on Terror were called “pro-terrorist” and those who opposed the invasion of Iraq were “pro-Saddam,” those who opposed the regime change wars of the CIA in Syria and Libya stood accused of being “pro-Assad” and “pro-Gaddafi” and those who now oppose the U.S. war in Ukraine are vilified as “pro-Putin” or “pro-Kremlin.” It's all designed to create a simple-minded dichotomy – in the words of George W. Bush: “You are either with us or you're with the terrorists.” 

Exactly as it was done back in 2001 and 2002, this rancid propaganda framework is used to justify the imposition of authoritarian powers. As long as you can successfully pin the label “pro-Hamas” to the foreheads of those who dissent from the current war policies, who cares if they're censored, put on a blacklist, fired, made unemployable or worse? After all, they're “pro-Hamas,” who would possibly care what happens to such people? 

The Biden administration announced just a few hours ago – as The Wall Street Journal reported – that “The U.S. military has selected roughly 2,000 troops to prepare for a potential deployment to support Israel, U.S. defense officials said." Don't worry, though they “are not intended to serve in a combat role,” the official said. This war is already more dangerous than the war in Ukraine, and that's a very dangerous war. It's between the U.S. and Russia, the two largest nuclear powers on the planet. In this new war, regional escalation is highly possible, if not likely. The U.S. is already heavily involved, deploying aircraft carriers, providing bombs and money, deploying more aircraft carriers, and now designating troops that might be deployed. Any tactics that are designed to vilify aid, vilify good faith dissent, or worse ones that are designed to justify official state censorship – such as France's banning of all pro-Palestinian protests while still allowing all pro-Israel protests because those are aligned with the government policy – any such tactics like that deserve our scorn and our attention. So that's what we're going to give it tonight as we explore the latest developments in this war between Israel and Gaza and how it is being discussed and exploited in the United States and the West more broadly. 

For now, welcome to a new episode of System Update, starting right now.

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Hey @IndieBee, is this, below, short enough for you, you constantly complaining kind of fuck tard, who thinks he ought to be able to control other people's actions and free speech.
Fuck you're obviously the kind of cunt who's parents had obviously never ever said no to you even once.

If you think my shit is too long for you to read, then don't read it. Isn't that simple enough for you as an individual?
But no, you have to write something trying to tell another person how to post stuff, don't you?

Is your picture in the dictionary next to the word narcissist? If not, it ought to be, right? - Get some self awareness you stupid lunatic.
You actually think anyone else actually gives a fuck if you are not perfectly happy, as if we care to make our posts exactly how you want it? Just go fuck yourself instead of trying to tell other people what or how to post 'their own stuff', yah?

Up here in Canada they've taken away all our voices on social media, I truly believe this means that if these ...

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USAID Sucks! And so does the 'woke' Left

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Rubio's Shift: What is Trump's Foreign Policy? | Trump/Musk Attack CIA Fronts USAID & NED: With Mike Benz
System Update #401

The following is an abridged transcript from System Update’s most recent episode. You can watch the full episode on Rumble or listen to it in podcast form on Apple, Spotify, or any other major podcast provider.

System Update is an independent show free to all viewers and listeners, but that wouldn’t be possible without our loyal supporters. To keep the show free for everyone, please consider joining our Locals, where we host our members-only aftershow, publish exclusive articles, release these transcripts, and so much more!


Ever since Donald Trump entered the White House to begin his second term, there has been – by design – a flurry of highly significant orders, policies and changes, most of which, for better or worse, were promised during the campaign. The rapidity of these changes has created the impression for some that there is no coherence behind them, that they are all just designed to appease Trump's base voters with symbolism or to impose frantic vengeance.

If one digs deeply enough, one can locate a coherent worldview, especially when it comes to Trump's foreign policy changes. When Trump began nominating a series of conventional establishment Republicans to key positions after the election, people like Marco Rubio at State and Elise Stefanik at the U.N. and others – many people demanded of us that we denounce these picks, given that they signaled that Trump's pledge for a new kind of foreign policy was clearly a fraud. In response, my answer was always the same: even though I didn't like some of those picks, I never thought that one could reliably read into every one of Trump's choices some sort of tarot card about what Trump would do given that I kept hearing from Trump's closest circle for a long time now that they were determined to ensure that all of Trump's picks this time around would follow rather than subvert his vision as laid out in the campaign. 

Marco Rubio just gave an interview to Megyn Kelly late last week that strongly suggests this is true, as Rubio sounded far less like the standard GOP warmonger he has been for years and a lot more like a committed America First advocate, with a series of surprising acknowledgments, highly unusual for someone occupying a high place in U.S. government officialdom. We’ll look at that, as well as the Trump administration's foreign policy actions thus far to determine which consistent and cohesive principles can be identified. 

Then: Our guest is Mike Benz, a former State Department official during the first Trump administration who has become one of the most outspoken and knowledgeable critics of the US Security State. In the last year, he has appeared on the shows of both Joe Rogan and Tucker Carlson to do so. He has become a font of information about why USAID in particular is such a destructive, toxic and wasteful agency – as Democrats march to protect it - and he'll be here with us to talk about why that is.


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Donald Trump often railed against the toxic and evil influence of neocons, particularly in American foreign policy, throughout 2023 and 2024, as he attempted to return to the White House. He seemed convinced of it and had a lot of policy initiatives designed to undermine the promises of neoconservatism and, in the process, alienated a lot of them, beginning with things like his opposition to or at least skepticism about the U.S. involvement in the war in Ukraine, the U.S. making NATO a central part of our foreign policy, even though the original purpose which is to deter the Soviet Union from invading Western Europe, obviously no longer applies, and a whole variety of other pieties of the foreign policy establishment Donald Trump was waging a frontal assault on. 

Once Trump won the election and began choosing his national security cabinet, a lot of people immediately concluded that all of that must be a fraud because Trump was choosing people like Marco Rubio, Elise Stefanik, Mike Huckabee to be the U.S. ambassador to Israel, like John Ratcliffe at the CIA, like Mike Waltz to be his National Security Advisor, who have a long history similar to Mike Pompeo or Nikki Haley or even Liz Cheney in endorsing this sort of posture of endless war, of having the U.S. dominate the world in exactly the way that would please most neocons. 

Although, as I said, I wasn't thrilled with those picks, I wasn't the one elected, so my choices would be much different. I was very resistant to the idea that simply because Trump was choosing some, by no means all, but some politicians who have a long history of establishment dogma. Those are the ones who sped through confirmation in the Senate, of course, including with lots of Democratic support. It didn't mean that those people were going to be governing foreign policy in the Trump administration because it was clear that Donald Trump knew that he was the one who won this race and intended to impose his vision on the world and wanted loyalists around him who would carry out those visions. 

In contrast to the first term, when he had a lot of people there who were deliberately sabotaging his foreign policy, often applauded by the media, including members, by the way, of the U.S. military, which meant that the U.S. military was essentially seizing civilian control of foreign policy, seizing control from democratically elected officials and assigning it to themselves so that they would often counter or even ignore his foreign policy decisions and they would be celebrated by the press as the adult in the room. This was all something that I knew from hearing from many people inside the Trump circle, both on the show and otherwise, that they were most determined to avoid. And so, when they were picking the Marco Rubios and the Elise Stefaniks, I wasn't happy about it but I also knew that it wasn't proof that Trump was going to lead a conventional U.S. foreign policy because it was clear that they were picking people who, beyond any particular set of beliefs, was willing to be loyal to Donald Trump's worldview and his agenda, because that's what had just been ratified by the American people. 

Even The New York Times in the wake of Trump’s victory in November, and I'm not sure they meant this as a compliment or as a warning, but either way, they were the ones who were coming out and saying, look, these people were neocons for sure, but they've now made radical, visible and palpable changes to the way they talk about foreign policy. Here, The New York Times headline:

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Tulsi's Hearing Exposes Bipartisan Rot of DC Swamp
System Update #400

The following is an abridged transcript from System Update’s most recent episode. You can watch the full episode on Rumble or listen to it in podcast form on Apple, Spotify, or any other major podcast provider.

System Update is an independent show free to all viewers and listeners, but that wouldn’t be possible without our loyal supporters. To keep the show free for everyone, please consider joining our Locals, where we host our members-only aftershow, publish exclusive articles, release these transcripts, and so much more!


Tulsi Gabbard appeared before the Senate Intelligence Committee today – a committee specifically constructed to feature only blind supporters of the US Security State – and she was unsurprisingly, relentlessly pummeled by members of both political parties as part of her confirmation process to become Director of National Intelligence. I don’t want to make any predictions – the vote will be held after a secret session – but there is a real chance that some Senate Republicans will defect and her nomination could be in serious jeopardy. 

What matters is the reason these committee members were so enraged by her. They focused almost the entire session for hours in public on two and only two issues: 1) Tulsi has expressed support for NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, heralding him as a courageous whistleblower, and 2) she has expressed opposition to laws – specifically Section 702 of FISA – which allows the FBI and NSA to spy on American citizens without the warrants required by law. In other words, these committee members were furious with Tulsi Gabbard for having opposed the U.S. government's abuse of its spying power and their lies about it to the American public. 

So much of this hearing today so vividly illustrated exactly what is so destructive, grotesque and deceitful about the bipartisan DC establishment – what Donald Trump has so aptly referred to for eight years now as The Swamp. I can't think of a day that more viscerally demonstrated who these people are and why their dogma has been so damaging. 

We’re going to take the show tonight to really break down what happened today. There are so many components to it, so many dimensions that are really worth analyzing and because it was bipartisan, it says so much about the real way Washington works. 


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Yesterday, I sat through almost the entire confirmation hearing of Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to become Donald Trump's Health and Human Services Secretary where he was relentlessly attacked, as we covered and reported last night, by multiple members of that committee. The same exact thing happened today with Tulsi Gabbard in front of the Senate Intelligence Committee although she was attacked by members of both political parties, not just one. It also happened in the Senate Judiciary Committee, where Kash Patel appeared for his confirmation hearing to become director of the FBI.

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RFK Jr. Hearing Reveals DC Pro-Pharma Consensus | Trump's Executive Order to Deport Student Protesters Criticizing Israel | Untangling DC Think Tank Funding & Influence
System Update #399

The following is an abridged transcript from System Update’s most recent episode. You can watch the full episode on Rumble or listen to it in podcast form on Apple, Spotify, or any other major podcast provider.

System Update is an independent show free to all viewers and listeners, but that wouldn’t be possible without our loyal supporters. To keep the show free for everyone, please consider joining our Locals, where we host our members-only aftershow, publish exclusive articles, release these transcripts, and so much more!


If you told someone that Trump would appoint a lifelong pro-choice Democratic Party environmental lawyer to lead our country's health agencies and that Democrats would then unite and enrage opposition to him, you would likely be very surprised, especially if you heard that – just a week ago – all those Democrats unanimously united to vote to make Marco Rubio secretary of state. This is exactly what is happening: Democrats led by people like Ron Wyden, Liz Warren and Bernie Sanders, were quite vicious and scathing in maligning virtually every aspect of RFK Jr.'s character, repeatedly portraying him as a corrupted sell-out, a science denier and opponent of vaccines who will directly kill huge numbers of children with his policies. 

For months now, Israel supporters have been looking for a way to criminalize both protests against the Israeli war in Gaza and, even more menacingly, speech that is critical of the foreign government that they revere. That effort to destroy the First Amendment to protect this foreign country received a major boost today when President Trump announced an executive order for the deportation of anyone legally in the U.S. on a student visa, but who participated in protests against the Israeli destruction of Gaza. This is a pure speech-based order, by which I mean that if you're a foreign student legally in the U.S. and you protest in favor of Israel, even if you commit crimes while doing so, you're perfectly fine: no worries at all. You're a foreign student; you're allowed to protest in defense of Israel and your visa will not be jeopardized even if you break the law. This order only threatens those who protest against Israel: a classically unconstitutional assault on free speech, which is purely viewpoint-based. 

In our third segment, we’ll talk to Nick Cleveland-Stout, a research fellow in the democratizing foreign policy unit of the Quincy Institute. He has been producing some very interesting and important reports on exactly who is behind the most influential think tanks in Washington and how that funding shapes their influence over our government. 


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I just want to show you a couple of clips from RFK Jr.'s confirmation hearing today that took place before the Senate Finance Committee because it was really something that was far more virulent, I think, than a lot of people expected. 

Obviously, Democrats in large numbers were going to be opposed, although some suggested they might be open to it, and yet the venom that they used to treat RFK Jr., a lifelong Democrat, a pro-choice environmental lawyer whom Donald Trump has tapped to lead the health agencies was something that was really quite remarkable. They really tried to do everything possible, not just to suggest he was unqualified for the position or dangerous in it, but really to destroy his character in every way. 

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